Handrange %-age Flop Turn River SENSE?!

[js2002]

Hi,

I´m planning 2 new stats this night. And I´m asking you, if you think they make sense and which ;)

First stat:
saw flop / cnt_hands
saw turn / cnt_hands
saw river / cnt_hands
maybe saw SD /cnt_hands because its different to the WTSD

Second stat:
saw flop / cnt_hands
saw turn / saw flop
saw river / saw turn
maybe SD again

I´m not very sure how to interpret the results of these stats.
@1: maybe this indicator help little on "how much hands does he take to the street x"
@2: maybe this indicates sth about the degression f.e. -x^y (f.e. flop 50% turn 18% river 3%) or a proportial (flop 60% turn 30% river 15%) leaving of hand.

What do you think?

[kraada]

I'm really not sure what you're doing here so I'm not sure whether it'd be useful or not.

Your "first stat" seems like four, and either 3 or 4 for your second stat . . . what are you doing with those 3/4 values?

[js2002]

omg,

http://rapidshare.com/files/205783221/h ... e.rar.html

2 Stats for each street.

1. Handrange Flop, Turn and River
2. Handrange relativ Flop, Turn and River

So 6 real stats. I could be 8 because we could do this for the "street" Showdown as well. sense? usefullness?! dunno....

Further I though a little bit:
The Handrange relativ Turn could be called WTT (Went to Turn), because it´s like the WTSD.
This doesn´t apply to the Handrange relativ River, because the River stat doesn´t depend on the saw flop.

Kraada, plz take time to think of the sense of these stats and if they are usefull. Maybe they even have a connection to the real handrange like AQ+,JJ+ = x%.

in action: [ img ]

[kraada]

Well, I could see some people liking these sorts of stats, but I'm personally not sure I'd want to use them, mostly because I'm not sure how I'd want them factoring into my decision making. First of all, whether someone gets to the river with a given hand depends on how he plays his hands and how his opponents plays their hands, as you don't get to a river sometimes because you fold and sometimes because they fold.

Imagine a player who never raises with any hand except AA preflop and never bets or raises postflop unless he has an overpair or better, and he bets or raises every chance he can get with these hands.

What's his range of hands on the river? I don't know. It depends on what his opponents know about him. If I were his opponent, he'd only get to the river with one pair hands, draws, or hands that improved on the river. Why? I'd fold every time he bet or raised unless I had the pure nuts. I have literally no idea what his results would look like on this sort of stat because it really depends on how much his opponents are paying attention.

That's not to say there isn't any information that could be drawn from these stats. Maybe there is and it's not obvious to me (stranger things have happened, I assure you), but I'm not sure how I'd use these stats in isolation to put my opponent on any sort of range.

[js2002]

I understand your thoughts and they make sense.

I´m to tired now and also dont get a very useful solution for this stats. Maybe some other PT3 forum user do...

I idea of the stats was created as I saw a stat like this in "Elephant" a tool like PT3.

They built Flop Handrange to replace the VPIP because they thought they get more information. But that got corrected and they use a VPIP now, but they still have a connection of this stat to a real handrange, that comfused me, the support is not so fast and sometimes they dont answer either :(

so long ...

good n8

[kraada]

I'm sorry, I've never used Elephant so I'm not sure what stat they're using. It's possible that the stat they originally built simply didn't do what they thought it did, I'm honestly not sure.